Tuesday, 23 August 2011

Online Shopping

This is a salutary record of how we can all fall foul of what are apparently Internet sharks.  Recently I decided to upgrade my ageing camcorder with a newer HD version.  I had planned to use it for interviewing people professionally for a new web project and so decided to splash out on a semi-pro camera.  The first problem you encounter when buying video equipment is the NTSC/PAL issue.  For some reason, probably market protectionism, the different formats still persist.  The first few vendors who had fantastic prices and were presenting the devices as UK, when further questioning was levelled at them, admitted that they were selling NTSC products.  It was not trivial to avoid this trap.  Not wishing to have to research this phenomenon further I decided it would be safer to buy a listed PAL product from the UK and pay a premium.

With an upcoming holiday looming I looked for a supplier who had a product in stock for a reasonable price.  I researched a little about the websites that I found but eventually, evidently without sufficient research, I made the plunge.  


Please see the following email exchange:


----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, July 25, 2011 3:26 PM
Subject: Order MM09HE20000442

Hi
I ordered a camcorder from you 7 days ago (order number: MM09HE20000442).  Is there anyway I can track the order.  What is its eta.  I am going away at the weekend and expected to have the device for then.

with kind regards

Jim
______________________________________________________________________________________________
On 26 Jul 2011, at 11:05, Pro Visual World wrote:
Hello Jim

Delivery is Tuesday next week
Regards
Pro Visual World



______________________________________________________________________________________________

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, July 26, 2011 11:20 AM
Subject: Re: Order MM09HE20000442

Hi

That is really disappointing, I'm sure the item was listed as "in stock" as this was one of my criteria for choosing your firm.  Would someone be able to call me to discuss.  I shall be out of the country from Saturday 30th July for 2 weeks.  I would like to discuss

1.  Paying for accelerated delivery
2.  Collecting the device
3.  Delivery to a location in France.

kind regards

Jim

Mobile deleted
______________________________________________________________________________________________

On 27 Jul 2011, at 10:16, Pro Visual World wrote:
Hi Jim

We can arrange for delivery to immediately upon your return
Regards
Pro Visual World
______________________________________________________________________________________________

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, July 27, 2011 12:41 PM
Subject: Re: Order MM09HE20000442

Dear Pro Visual World

Thank you for the response.

I am not sure I understand your business model, or why it takes 24 hours to get each response by email.  I'm sure there is a sensible explanation.  On the website it said the product was in stock but there was no mention of how long it would take for the delivery.  In my view there is no reason why an item in stock cannot be dispatched immediately.  I feel very let down by your service as we are about to go on an important holiday and I bought the camera specifically to record it.  Thankfully I can use my old camera that isn't HD but your failure to provide clear information has significantly disadvantaged me.

I have offered 3 reasonable solutions that all involve additional cost to me that I was willing to bear to get the device on time and you haven't even done me the courtesy of responding to them.  Instead you respond with a single sentence that can be misinterpreted.

Do you mean:

1) On my written return you will dispatch the camera to me immediately
2) On my actual return from France you will dispatch the device

If you mean (1) then I apologise sincerely and look forward to receiving the device tomorrow.  If, as I suspect, you meant (2) then I shall be returning on Saturday 13 August.  We have family staying at the house during the 2 weeks but they will be out touring during most days so it would be more convenient if it arrived on or after the 14th.

Sincerely

Jim
______________________________________________________________________________________________


On 28 Jul 2011, at 09:37, Pro Visual World <sales@provisualworld.com> wrote:

Hello James

We will arrange for the order to arrive with you on Monday 15th August
Regards
Pro Visual World


______________________________________________________________________________________________


On 17 Aug 2011, at 12:42, James McDermott wrote:

The product has not been delivered by 12:30 on the 17August. Is there a problem?  Please supply the UPS tracking number

Sent from my iPad
______________________________________________________________________________________________

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Thursday, August 18, 2011 6:38 PM
Subject: Re: Order MM09HE20000442

No response within 24 hours as promised and no product delivered.  The cash has been taken off my Visa card.

I have called

KamKorda Ltd
1 The Limes,
BURTON-ON-TRENT,
DE15 0NW

Tel : 01283 516630


but get the message to email this address.

Please respond as requested.

______________________________________________________________________________________________


On 19 Aug 2011, at 06:33, Pro Visual World wrote:

Your order is with PVW at Wakefield James
KK are our Logistics company
We will check your order James and email back today
Regards

Pro Visual World

______________________________________________________________________________________________


----- Original Message -----
Sent: Saturday, August 20, 2011 3:03 PM
Subject: Re: Order MM09HE20000442

Look.  What is going on?  You have had significant funds deposited to your bank account for a product that was listed as *In stock*  this was over a month ago.  If you are unable to complete this order as advertised please indicate.


This link is to confirm to you that I understand my rights and that I am eligible for a full refund if the product hasn't been delivered within 30 days, as no delivery date was given.  I should also warn you that if I seen no progress on a delivery.  Minimum - Company name, delivery reference and confirmed date.  Then I will be making an official complaint.

Mr J McDermott

______________________________________________________________________________________________


On 21 Aug 2011, at 07:59, Pro Visual World wrote:
Hi James

Your order will be despatched to you this coming week.  The only reason for any delay has been the scarcity of this line currently
Regards
Pro Visual World


______________________________________________________________________________________________


----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, August 21, 2011 12:30 PM
Subject: Re: Order MM09HE20000442

Dear Pro Visual World,

I will take your offer at face value for now.  I earnestly request that you send details to me immediately of the delivery firm but critically, the dispatch number or reference number.

I would point out that under my own interpretation of the Trades Description legislation and the The Advertising Standards Authority (ASA) code of practice, your websites are currently breaking the law.

If I do not receive the product or the details I have requested by Monday 22 August 2011, I shall be forced to take further action.  This email will be forwarded to my solicitor and to the Advertising Standards Agency in preparation for that action.  Should you comply with my request I shall withdraw the action.

Yours sincerely

Mr McDermott

______________________________________________________________________________________________


On 22 Aug 2011, at 09:28, Pro Visual World <sales@provisualworld.com> wrote:

James

Your order will arrive with you on Friday.
We will provide tracking on Thursday
Regards

Pro Visual World


______________________________________________________________________________________________


----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, August 22, 2011 11:33 AM
Subject: Re: Order MM09HE20000442

Dear Pro Visual World

You have failed to provide evidence that the product will be delivered or the reasonable information I have requested.  I find this suspicious given that it is now 6 weeks since you banked my money.  Having said this, I am prepared to wait until Thursday this week to see if you are good to your word and that you will provide me with details of the delivery firm and the dispatch notification.  I will postpone my notification to the Advertising Standards Authority.  I would note that you still state on your website that you use UPS as a delivery firm.  It is vital that you understand that our premises are difficult to find, only the larger firms that visit regularly know how to find us.  Please confirm that you have provided the mobile phone contact number to them.

Please inform me if you anticipate any changes to your delivery schedule.  I must warn you that should this go to court, I have saved screen shots of your website during my order process and I have stored all communications and the results of my investigations in to your organisation at companies house amongst other sources. I will state quite clearly now that if you are unable to fulfil the order as advertised please refund my money now and save us all the effort of legal action.  If however you are able to provide a Canon XA10 AVCHD HD PAL with a 12 month Canon UK warranty as advertised then please continue.

Yours sincerely

Mr J McDermott

Sent from my iPad

______________________________________________________________________________________________

Begin forwarded message:


From: Pro Visual World
Date: 23 August 2011 08:36:05 GMT+01:00
To: James McDermott
Subject: Re: Order MM09HE20000442


Your order is despatching to you this week and we will supply you with tracking later this week
Regards
Pro Visual World
www.provisualworld.com

______________________________________________________________________________________________

Anyone like to give me odds that I'll have the camcorder by Friday?

11 comments:

  1. Rejoice! - you life has not been in vain ;)

    I was searching for some info about this 'company' (a overly generous term, surely?) and happened upon your own woeful tale.

    To be fair - their awful website, and the absence of a contact telephon number should have given you pause for thought - not to mention their habit of listing camcorders costing several thousands of pounds, adjacent to £30 plastic gizmo's...

    However, I too was tempted (greed is the enemy of common sense, is it not?) so many thanks for your affirmation of my misgivings.

    Did you ever get your camera (or a refund, btw?)

    Regards

    Lucky Escapee

    ReplyDelete
  2. Thank you anonymous, it gives me a warm glow to know that I have in some way saved someone from the pain that I endured from that company. Yes, the clues were there and if greed for a cheap deal hadn't blurred my vision I may not have fallen foul of the fell vendors.

    I did indeed get the money back from them and I spent significantly more at another internet vendor for the same product. Peace of mind going sue way to placate my frustration at having to record our important summer holiday on an old DV tape camera. Hope you found what you were looking for.

    ReplyDelete
  3. not "sue" but "some". can't edit the comment :-/

    ReplyDelete
  4. OMG

    I have totally blanked what actually happened. I've just been and checked my emails as it didn't ring true and I was worried I had't checked that the money had been credited back to my card. They didn't refund the money, I received and email with a UPS delivery number in it and no dialogue on 26August and then the camera turned up a few days later. I was so incensed by the whole experience I couldn't write about it and apparently have blanked the whole episode. I had looked at a new vendor but decided not to buy it until the cash was returned and had saved the camera in the basket. Then the camera turned up from provisualripoff.

    ReplyDelete
  5. Hi Jimmy Mac,
    The camera incident is probably all history now but I noticed something today whilst looking for a mac laptop.
    The Company Alexander Trent trading on Amazon:
    http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B005ZHUZ4E/ref=asc_df_B005ZHUZ4E7954172?linkCode=asn&creative=22218&tag=reevoocomfalsepaid-21&creativeASIN=B005ZHUZ4E&smid=A1LZQUN1PHSG54

    uses the same phone number 01283 516630 that you had for Kamkorda ltd.
    I believe that the address they are giving is just a post box:
    Waterfront House, New Brunswick House WF1 5QW:



    http://www.mailboxuk.com/Forms/PriceList.pdf

    ReplyDelete
  6. Hey, Anonymous! Thank you for the information. I was looking for the lens for my camera and found Alexander Trent website. It made me cautious that there wasn't much information about the company on the site. Luckily I started to search more information on the Internet. All I got was the company name Alexander Trent and address Waterfront House, New Brunswick House WF1 5QW , UK. Thank you really much for sharing that information, that it's all a fake site. I really glad I didn't bought anything.

    ReplyDelete
  7. Hello any advice or information about mailboxuk.com. is it a creditable fowarding company. I live in USA and ordered something from amazon. Com.uk and it will be sent and forwarded to me by mailboxuk.com.. Nothing has gone wrong yet but I am nervous.

    ReplyDelete
  8. Hi Anonymous - I have no experience whatsoever of mailboxuk.com so I cannot help directly. However you should take some comfort that the website carries the Company registration number - you can check out the details at company house (http://wck2.companieshouse.gov.uk/0d2ed242be1a357a549e973d46b80794/wcframe?name=accessCompanyInfo) - and the VAT number. These make it look more legitimate.

    Seems like they were originally Tanna Residential limited and have been around since 1999. They are up to date with all their filings but I would be aware that they are classified as "Small" - According to the UK's Companies Act 2006 a small company is defined as one that does not have a turnover of more than £6.5million, a balance sheet total of more than £3.26 million and not more than 50 employees. Small doesn't mean bad, but its useful to know. Good luck.

    ReplyDelete
  9. Thank you do much for taking out the time to help me. You are a great person. I will look it up as you advised and post when the package arrives thanks again

    ReplyDelete
  10. Hi

    This company is also trading under Spencer Mann and is a con, this is no company and they will take your money but never return the funds and never supply a product.

    ReplyDelete
  11. Hi I received my package with no delay from mailbox.uk.com. I felt a little comfortable knowing that the payment was made with paypal. They charged me $75.00 to ship my package 2 day ups air mail to the USA and I received it in exactly two days. I am super happy that it all went smoothly because I was very nervous. My package was just four rolls of wallpaper that was sold out everywhere in the USA but was readily available in the U.K. thanks for your help jimmy mac!

    ReplyDelete

There was an error in this gadget